Mod Archive Forums
Music Production => MilkyTracker => Tracking => MilkyTracker Community => Topic started by: BamBooli on June 14, 2008, 23:30:21
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Aloha ...
I am new to tracking. I load Milkytracker and find it nice. But one thing i dont manage. I will load a stereo-sample, but i dont know how i can manage it in milkytracker.
Please help.
:D
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The XM file format does not support stereo samples. If you load a stero sample it will become mono, either both channels are mixed into a mono sample or you can choose between the right and the left channel. If you can't live without the stereo effect of your sample you need to make two instruments with the left and the right channels of your sample and play them in separate channels (and adjust panning accordingly).
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Aloha ...
Thanx for your answer and of course for the nice peace of software. I like the look of it. 20 years ago i have had a small time with tracker. Now the evolution of the music-making-software explode and tried some piano-roll-sequencer. I was not so creativ with it. It was boring. I think about the past and about the fun making music on an amiga.
Yes. That was a sign for me. I will have a nice time yet. Without thinking to get a record-deal. I am not so good to release my tracks. I will now make music for funn and a good time.
In which way you realise a stereo-track? Do you compose only with mono tracks and make some panning? I have alot questions. step by step. *hehe*
It will helpful to know how are other tracker think about stereo files.
BamBooli :)
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In which way you realise a stereo-track? Do you compose only with mono tracks and make some panning?
yes.. the way to create a stereo song is the same as real life... using mono mics. You are using mono tracks that are panned into the stereo field .
As simple rule, do center panning for low freq / bass sounds.. and pan left of right high freq sounds . DO not use extreme left or right panning.. leave this technique for stereo tricks only
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Aloha Kmuland ...
thank you for tips. With Drums and Percussion, I can well imagine. What I still do not understand. What is at the synthesizer? They are stereo.
Do I not something fundamental?
I sample a VSTi as stereo output. In real life the output of synths is stereo.
How do you do? Do you take only one channel of the sample and drop the other?
How do you work on leads and pads?
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I'd say most of the time you pick the "Mix" option and then use a mono sample with both the left and right channel information. But if you want to keep the original stereo image, you need to load both channels in different instrument/sample slots and set their panning to 00 for left and FF for right. Then you need to write two identical tracks in the pattern sequencer, only using the left channel sample for the first one and the right channel for the other.
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this is one reason why MOD Plug Tracker XM/IT files are incompatible with other Trackers/Players that read XM/IT files: Mod Plug Tracker lets you use true stereo samples. i did a lot of that until i found MPT was the ONLY program that played them properly. i've moved onto Renoise which lets you use stereo samples natively.
when working on other trackers like Milky or Fast Tracker, i've used the technique of panning left and right two identical notes and offsetting the timing slightly to emulate the disparity our ears experience in receiving a sound at two different times (very tiny difference in the time a sound gets to one ear compared to the other - the space between left and right ears is small but enough for each ear to receive the sound at different times - it gives us a sense of depth, that's how human hearing works - it's called "binaural").
when i want to use a stereo recording in a tracker not supporting stereo samples, i do what was mentioned above: two instruments. one for left sample. one for right sample. panned hard left and right, respectively. ensure that the notes are triggered exactly the same time. you might need to take your stereo samples and split the left and right portions into separate files to load into the tracker. you can do that with an editor like Sound Forge, or just import the sample two times (choosing different channels each time when asked what you want to do with the extra data the tracker can't use).
as for VSTi and hardware synths... lots of what you hear as "stereo" are effects applied to the output. chorus, delay and reverb (which are all forms of delaying one signal in the left and right set, anyway). lots of old synths sound "bad" to us today because they didn't have effects. in the old days, you had to add those in the recording and mixing process with other dedicated equipment. MODs are a bit like that, in a way.
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i did a lot of that until i found MPT was the ONLY program that played them properly.
Not true.
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not true? ok, excellent. can you let me know which other trackers/players recognize the MPT modified XM/IT format (aside from MP Player)?
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For example BeroTracker and SchismTracker.
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Aren't both of them based on OpenMPT?
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http://eval.sovietrussia.org/wiki/Schism_Tracker (http://eval.sovietrussia.org/wiki/Schism_Tracker)
"The player is based on a highly modified version of the Modplug engine, with a number of bugfixes and changes to improve IT playback."
can't find info about BeRoTracker... it runs on my machine only in "Compatible mode" with terrible GUI responsiveness but audio seems fine (my video card is an old Matrox G400 and OpenGL/Direct3D seems unavailable, and the program renders to screen via OpenGL).
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BeRo is not based on any other tracker. Schism was based on libmodplug, yes, but that is besides the point: Since the .IT format can handle stereo samples, Schism naturally has support for stereo samples - so XM stereo samples are also loaded. Mind you, the Schism loaders have been completely rewritten and do not resemble the old libmodplug loaders anymore.
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not true? ok, excellent. can you let me know which other trackers/players recognize the MPT modified XM/IT format (aside from MP Player)?
MilkyTracker reads them, but it converts the stereo samples into mono ones, heh ;)
As discussed many times already it has been a stupid idea to "extend" the format in a way that they're no longer backwards compatible and they cannot even be loaded with FT2 anymore. But the same holds true for more than 32 channels and similar things.
But that's just the way it is now... :rolleyes:
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Well, I do not say that it is a great thing Olivier has done there, but that's indeed how the situation is and OpenMPT is actually capable of removing all "extensions" automatically.
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BeRo is not based on any other tracker. Schism was based on libmodplug, yes, but that is besides the point: Since the .IT format can handle stereo samples, Schism naturally has support for stereo samples - so XM stereo samples are also loaded. Mind you, the Schism loaders have been completely rewritten and do not resemble the old libmodplug loaders anymore.
The point is, the IT format is neither a complete XM superset nor is Schism meant to correctly play XM modules. So yes, you will gain the possibility to load and play stereo samples and at the same time you will lose true XM effect compatibility.
And another point is that nobody will actually use BeroTracker or Schism to play XM songs that's pretty obvious.
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...and OpenMPT is actually capable of removing all "extensions" automatically.
That's nice, but how does it improve the format mess MPT left behind?
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Not at all, but it should keep people from producing even more mess. :)