Mod Archive Forums

Music Production => MilkyTracker => Tracking => MilkyTracker Feature Requests => Topic started by: MovieMovies1 on March 04, 2018, 21:06:46

Title: Add an option to lower .mod pitch?
Post by: MovieMovies1 on March 04, 2018, 21:06:46
As far as I can tell, Amiga modules in at least ProTracker have a slightly lower pitch than XM files do in both FastTracker2 and Milky. Milky as of now uses XM pitches while playing back mod files, which is what FT2 does. This often makes mod files that rely on drumloops and related things sound off.

Considering all the other amigamod compatibility options that are already added to MilkyTracker, I don't think adding an option to lower the pitch to the Amiga's standard to improve compatibility with modules that rely on drumloops and stuff would be too much of a stretch. It would certainly help when I try to make amigamods myself, so I don't have to drop it off in another editor just to make sure my samples line up right.

Do forgive me if this is something that has been asked about before.
Title: Re: Add an option to lower .mod pitch?
Post by: Deltafire on March 05, 2018, 21:12:34
This is the first I've heard of this.

Could you check that the playback mode is set to "Protracker 2/3.x" in Options?  You could also try setting the frequency table to Amiga in the config section.
Title: Re: Add an option to lower .mod pitch?
Post by: MovieMovies1 on March 05, 2018, 22:54:32
It's definitely all set to the correct ProTracker 2/3 playback settings and the Amiga frequency table, and the samples are definitely playing back slightly faster than they should.

I've provided two sample recordings in the attached zip file. Both play MilkyTracker's output first, then it plays ProTracker-win32's output.

 - "01 Pitch Difference.mp3" showcases the pitch difference, short and simple.
 - "02 Drumloop Mismatch.mp3" shows how this can be especially problematic, as MilkyTracker's output has a hiccupy feel in addition to having a serious click problem towards the end due to this sample speed mismatch.

I wish I had an actual Amiga to record this off, but sadly I don't, so this is the next best thing I can really do. It may also be something that actually differs between PAL and NTSC machines, so adding this as a switch option would probably be the best way if it is to be implemented.
Title: Re: Add an option to lower .mod pitch?
Post by: nikku4211 on March 06, 2018, 00:16:44
How about using WinUAE and emulating ProTracker? Will that work out for you?
Title: Re: Add an option to lower .mod pitch?
Post by: MovieMovies1 on March 06, 2018, 05:34:49
So I did set up WinUAE and managed to load up ProTracker 2.3d to test both PAL and NTSC modes to see if my hypothesis of PAL/NTSC differences being the cause. PAL matches the output of the Windows ProTracker clone and whatever other tools that match PAL pitch. NTSC matches up with MilkyTracker's current pitch output. It probably all comes down to overall machine clockspeed.

Considering a great big deal of Amiga modules were made with PAL machines, I'd say it'd be a good idea to implement an option for this via a switch, to keep compatibility with both PAL and NTSC Amiga modules alike, as well as .mod files not made for Amiga machines as well.
Title: Re: Add an option to lower .mod pitch?
Post by: Saga Musix on March 06, 2018, 12:59:02
The difference between PAL and NTSC playback is not just in pitch - it's also in playback tempo. So the modules still play correctly. At that point, it's probably just a matter of taste and not a compatibility problem.
Title: Re: Add an option to lower .mod pitch?
Post by: MovieMovies1 on March 06, 2018, 15:18:21
The difference between PAL and NTSC playback is not just in pitch - it's also in playback tempo. So the modules still play correctly. At that point, it's probably just a matter of taste and not a compatibility problem.

Testing with WinUAE further shows me that NTSC Amigas do indeed play slightly faster tempo-wise, but the samples still play ever-so-slightly higher than the pitch proportionally to the tempo, leading to the same problem that's happening with MilkyTracker and the drumloops (slightly hiccuppy sound, and the clicks), but less severely. I've attached a recording comparing both PAL and NTSC modes in WinUAE and how they affect the drumloop's hiccupyness and clickyness. So while playing PAL Amiga modules on an NTSC machine definitely is more correct in its playback than PAL modules in MilkyTracker, it's definitely not completely compatible.

Basically what I can deduct is that PAL .mods on PAL-adjusted players play fine, PAL .mods on NTSC Amigas play ever so slightly faster in pitch relative to tempo, and PAL .mods in MilkyTracker is just really off in regards to its tempo-pitch relationship, taking the issues of PAL mods in NTSC Amigas and exaggerating them. I'd still feel it would be worthwhile to add an option for PAL pitch, so MilkyTracker can play back MOD files correctly without the pitch-tempo mismatch it currently experiences.
Title: Re: Add an option to lower .mod pitch?
Post by: Deltafire on March 06, 2018, 16:40:13
I'd be interested to know how FastTracker II plays them, I suspect that is where Milkytracker has inherited the playback pitch/tempo from.
Title: Re: Add an option to lower .mod pitch?
Post by: MovieMovies1 on March 06, 2018, 17:34:38
Yeah, it inherits FT2's pitch and tempo for .mod playback, forgot to mention that in the previous post.